Well, yeah. I meant none of the pro-Obama folks had answered them. No joke, if we were talking about McCain right now I would be announcing the changing of my vote.
Oh please your questions are a fucking trap if i've ever seen one. I think people like Bush/Cheney are far greater of a threat to the American people then Ayers was. They were hippie radicals who fought "the man," if Obama was in cahoots with Timothy McVeigh or the Unabomber or something yeah I'd change my vote in a heart beat. People are so tired of Bush like politicians they are willing to let some guy become president who "knew" some radical. Tensions were high back then, the Weather Underground were making a desperate plea in their eyes as justice to an in-just government. Again, there actions weren't right. I can only imagine what will happen if we have another 4 years of Bush-like policies and lies. There are going to be far more Weather Undergrounds... and people taking actions into their own hands. Not good. Ridiculous... terrorist, obama bin laden... pathetic. More fear politics successfully delivered to the American people. Have you been listening to these McCain mobs on tv? I don't claim a party at all... i've worked with local, state, and federal government and have seen a little of everything. The McCain/Palin duo is a sad sight to see in America, it's just getting worse.
I pointed out the "Have you beat your wife yet?" nature of their question stack, but they just sailed on by that with "Mission Accomplished" statements... Note the smiley. This was an attempt at humor. This was not serious. I'm not feeling serious at the moment. Take a step back, take a moment, and SMILE, everybody! This thread has folks talking past each other, to the point they're running around the same arguments again and again. It's time to stop, and have a liberal/conservative group hug! No butt-grabbing, though! Let us all pray for peace in the thread!
Since when is the truth a trap? Trying to invalidate the questions won't make them go away. Not to a rational person anyway.
I am not pro/against obama or mccain or any other thing. I will try to answer those question. 1) Yes. But as for as i know he is a education professor now in some university. Not 100% sure. 2) Yes/No. Being affiliated with some one dont mean you condone or agree with there views or actions. Not to mention as time passes people learn and get wiser. Just because someone was bad in past dont mean they cant teach you some thing good in future. I have alot of friends in army i dont see the same way they do or like how they approach a given problem. They make too much chaos in reaching there given tasks. But i trust them. In the normal world. And in the field to cover my blind spots. Also i think i read obama was 8 years old then when Ayers was using hostile means (could be wrong about that i dont take much interest in domestic issues but i am trying to catch up with the normal world affairs). 3) Yes/ No. Same as number 2. Usually domestic problems are not some things that we concerned our self with. But i like the new presiden to be associated with any activist out there who think using hostile mean is ok. Knowing there state of mind allows you to find solution that can make both sides happy with least amount of damage to any one. Mostly to innocent people.
When it's incomplete or out of context, or when there are enforced constraints to the question set that opponents would rather break out of, such as an enforced yes/no answer to a question that is too complicated for a yes/no answer. Was he a terrorist? The New York branch of the underground was certainly so, though they managed to blow themselves up. The rest of them? They used bombs, but didn't set them to hurt anyone intentionally. Nonetheless they set bombs, and bombs will hurt people even if you don't mean it. We are all glad that 950 is still with us, for instance! So you could label them terrorists, and others could say "not so much", since they were trying to draw attention, rather than destroy a Nation. Is he a Communist? I'm not Joe McCarthy, and I don't give a rat's patootie whether he is or not. Did Obama know this? Who knows? Despite all "I can't believe he couldn't" responses, it's easy to see one not acquainting one's co-worker on education issues with a period of history one was too young to even clearly remember. I certainly didn't remember what Ayres looked like, or the trial either. Ditto for Ayres lack of remorse. Was he affiliated with this person? Obama was a community activist working to better the poor neighborhoods of Chicago, and joined the board of the Annenberg Challenge, along with an education activist who happened to have the name Bill Ayers, who had connections to Chicago politics, such as Mayor Daley. So yes, but so what? He was part of the Chicago political system, to be gone to to get anything done. Do we want someone who knew someone who was a terrorist, in a non-terrorist period, doing non-terrorist things to help non-terrorist Americans? More than I want the cranky deregulator McCain.
Ayers hosted Obama's party to announce his candidacy for the senate. Don't you think you would familiarize yourself with someone who was essentially launching your national political career? Saying that Obama didn't know who this guy was is an insult to our intelligence. I said "our" to throw you a bone.
Ayers hosted it. So what? Since he was working with him on the Annenberg Challenge, why should he suddenly feel the need to do a background check? Saying Obama HAD to know, or, more to the point, had any reason to figure there was something he had to know about his education activist colleague, is not an obvious conclustion to make. I'll use the marrow of that bone to make soup, and offer you some savory soup in return!
1) No he wasn't a domestic terrorist, he was an activist in my opinion. One mans terrorist is another mans martyr. 2) Yes 3) If we want to base the presidency off of associations then I'd imagine MSP that you would have never voted for bush and cheney twice. I'd also imagine that you wont be voting for McCain and Palin since Palin seems to be associated with some not so nice anti americans after all she is just a heart beat away from being the next president. The Palins' un-American activities | Salon I consider McCains association with Phil Graham to be a bigger deal and more of an issue considering he is directly related to the McCain campaign and key to helping McCain make decisions. But as someone has already mentioned, you see an issue and others see a non issue. Lets just agree to disagree
I'm preceding this with the fact that I don't like either candidate so I'm not choosing sides...but how the hell is an activist the same as a terrorist from a POV? He blew things up! Activists don't blow shit up!
You're a moron. Back to the topic at hand: I thought that Obama was different. Lying about associates seems rather 'business as usual' politics. Just more proof that however wins, we lose.
By definitition you are correct. I probably can't explain what I mean but I'll put it to you like this: When america was under british rule did/do we consider those that rose up against them terrorist?
Are you capable of explaining that? As far as some of you thinking Ayers isn't a terrorist or, just not giving a shit, I just don't know what to say. It sickens and saddens me. It makes me wonder what you really deem as a threat......Phil Graham? C'mon?
I base what I deem a threat by considering the ramifications of ones actions and how many people are affected by such actions. Bin laden helped plan and kill 3000+ people. George Bush, through his poor decisions, has lead 4000+ and counting, americans to their death. How many deaths did Ayers cause? How many people were affected by his actions? How long were the results of his actions felt? Now Phil Gramm on the other hand has had a direct affect on millions of peoples lives, no he didn't kill anyone but his actions had a far greater impact. Here is one example: Enron And the Gramms - New York Times
Here is a little more info on Ayers and Obama's relationship. Obama's Links To Ex-Radical Examined : NPR Is that what you consider a threat?
So would you have deemed lyndon b johnson a threat, for killing so many during the viet nam war? Are drug dealers not a threat? I mean, they don't directly kill anyone. They just provide a service... how about jfk for the bay of pigs invasion? You can't base your beliefs solely on the death toll, unless you judge everyone in the same way. You don't have to be a mass murderer, or organize it to be considered dangerous. Those who use fear to suport an agenda are terrorists. Case closed. How can you guys honestly defend ayers? He used explosives to support an agenda, which had the potential to kill hundreds if not thousands. ~Will Courtier~
Obviously by the examples I gave in my previous post, deaths are not what I use to perceive what is and isn't a threat. Think about that last scentence I quoted and ask yourself this, Has this administration used fear to gain support for their agenda? Did McCain help grow that fear and push for the same agenda? Now read the scentence before that: Thanks for helping to make my point
Not sure if I give a shit about this. I think I wish Palin was running for president. Yeah, she's ass backwards on social issues, but I'd take those stupid things if it meant having a fiscal conservative in office. As it stands, Obama and McCain both look like chucklefucks. E: It is pretty funny to see everyone associated distancing themselves from this as fast as possible.
This is why I haven't said anything about this. Neither one of them has impressed me thus far, and I don't plan on being impressed anytime soon. So far all I've gathered is that they're both crooks in a sense, they just have different schemes of robbing you. I was even going to tell everybody how funny I thought the train analogy picture was, but I decided not to.
One man's domestic terroistr, is another man's patriot. Revere, and company were concidered domestic t'rists.
Directly responsible if you loose your job, income, retirement savings/401K, home? "Between 1995 and 2000, Gramm was the chairman of the U.S. Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs." Though, this is an anti-democratic vid, both sides of the isle are actually implicated in real life: YouTube - Burning Down The House: What Caused Our Economic Crisis?
