WTF? why is upholding and enforcing laws that are already on the books so hard to do? http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36735281/ http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36746687/ns/us_news/ I just can't understand the difficulty there is in enterpreting the word: "illegal".
When it cuts into the bottom line of all those companies that depend on those illegal 'things' they push against the government and as we know, the government responds to money, not what is right.
I read about this last night when I was tired so I may be off but I don't think the problem is with the illegal aliens. I think it's with the bill itself. It grants police the power to racially profile and detain people who otherwise may not be bothered. If they don't produce ID immediately, they can be arrested (IIRC). I'm all for stopping illegal immigration but not trampling on the rights of people who are legal.
OK, somebody give me the cliff notes. Does everybody have to produce papers, or just Latinos? If it's everybody then I have no problem with the law.
Well yah, it's "everybody" but who do you think they will be targeting? Not people who look like you or I.
It's just like underage sales of tobacco and alcohol to minors. I am asked for my license all the time, and happily comply because I know it's for the greater good. They have to do something, it's getting bad down there.
Is it just me, or does that bear a disturbing resemblance to the Civil Protection vans in Half Life 2? The Hispanic community is up in arms because they know the whole community will be affected, rather than just the illegal immigrants, and they'll be forced to show papers at every stoplight, in the Hispanic equivalent of being pulled over for "driving while black"... It's amazing just what sort of laws are still on the books all over the US. Here's some stuff from Illinois...
Well the sad reality is that a) none of the illegals crossing the border are white, black, yellow, or green, and b) the legal immigrant community harbors them and provides material support. Call it profiling or whatever, but in this case the skin color of those breaking the law and those being profiled by authorities is not being chosen by the authorities or the voters. The immigrants legal and otherwise have chosen and caused this situation, and the reason they're so up in arms is because it'll likely be pretty effective at thwarting them.
Actually, there are PLENTY of illegals in the U.S. who happen to be white! We just don't look for them so pervasively. They should just change the law so that law enforcement checks the legal status of everyone they stop. It can't be that much harder since they do criminal background checks anyway... Edit: (since MSP's post below) If an ecological activist from Europe were here illegally, would that make him a "green" illegal immigrant? HAHAHAHAHAHaHaHahahahahaha HAAAAA!
This is part of the laws just passed in Arizona. Tell me, do illegals of other nationalities (white or otherwise) come here, collect taxpayer dollars and then ship a large portion of those dollars back to their country of origin? Most of what I've read about the recent Arizonian laws passed, are simply a matter of enforcing laws already on the books. What's the deal with that? While we're at it, taxation under it's present form is not equal. let's do away with enforcing that also. In actuality, the citizenship of everyone is checked at any time a peace officer asks for ID. The act of asking for a license takes into concideration that a valid birth certificate was used to obtain that document. A peace officer has the legal backing to ask anyone, anytime, anywhere and under any circumstance to produce identification.
Actually, mistawiskas, a lot of immigrants from all over the world, legal and illegal, come to the US to do exactly what you just described: send money to their families living in other countries. Hispanics are not the only ones, they're just a majority. Assuming that the government has no plans to reform immigration laws, then they should enforce our current ones. That is, deport illegals, deny them access to public services paid for by taxpayers, and fine companies who hire illegal labor. I was talking to a guy who works in the prison system, and he was telling me how instead of deporting illegal immigrants, we keep them in our prisons. So we're paying thousands and thousands of dollars in room and board for these fuckers. Is that not the kind of wasteful tax spending we should be concerned about?
I read some interesting history on illegal immigrants in Arizona; how Arizona basically needed them during the housing boom, and do this now that the boom has gone bust, with the support of people living in the houses that those illegals built for them. Use 'em and throw 'em away! Disposable people Combine that with the fact that the Arizona desert is now the route used by smugglers (people & drugs in, weapons out [though smuggling INTO Mexico is far easier than smuggling OUT]), since all the shorter, less dangerous routes have been blocked, and it's all just a big cockeyed mess of our own making...
I dont exactly remember where i read this. However IRS did a study that showed, illegal immigrants pay over Billion $$ in taxes. Also that rate is on a climb. Contrary to popular belief they pay more taxes then most people realize, and receive not enough services/benefits (strictly speaking for those who are paying taxes). Personally, i am all for helping them, i have worked in many hell holes, and truly can see what compels a father or bother or son to leave family behind so he can find a better future for their family. As long GOVT do thorough background check, we should allow them/help them to better there future. Even the cops in that state are against that policy. Because it creates hostile relationship between the cops and people. And no matter for what reason a person in power shouldn't promote racial profiling. The solution to this problem is not to throw them out but to fix our immigration system. Help them integrate in our system, and use them to better our economy. With fines and fees that we can put on them, so they can be put on a path to legalization, we will make profit in Billions.
the law will end up basically being racist, well-intenioned or not what they need to do is fix the visa/citizenship deal. Most of the (illegal) mexicans here don't really know shit about it and thus aren't motivated to get involved with it. If they made the effort to educate people on the benefits and what they need to do, i think we would see a lot less illegals. They need to do a huge bump on the quota (I believe it is stupidly low as of now) or eliminate it all together. At this point we have to just accept that the immigration tide is going to continue to flow
What are the rulings about the constitutional rights of illegal immigrants? Are they granted the same freedoms that citizens are, or are they given only basic human rights?
Fuck yeah!!! When did the law go from this, to what it is now. We used to deport, we used to require proof of citizenship, we used to do everything you said should be done. goofus, as a naturalized citizen, and a member of the proffessions you wrote of, I can tell you without a doubt, that those consequences have befallen 90% of all building/construction proffessions. How would anyone on here like their jobs to go away because you cannot compete with crooked contractors that hire illegals and pay them 5 bux an hour under the table and not pay the same taxes and deductions that citizens and honest contractors must pay. Not to mention the loss in wages that have taken place just to be able to compete when competition is possible? This is utter bullshit from what I have witnessed first hand so i cannot pay a lot of attention to any report that even remotely suggests this. Sounds a lot like a claim from the standpoint of immigration advoctes/proponents. Just the use of the word "immigration" is a ruse. Because, in fact, what has happened is "invasion". In the past, an immigrant came here through proper channels, learned the ways of the land and the common language, got a job and supported their families whether here or abroad while paying taxes on what they earned. When there is no record of exactly what is earned, how the hell can anyone accurately state: " IRS did a study that showed, illegal immigrants pay over Billion $$ in taxes". Did this "study" involve ESP or guesswork? Undocumented=undocumented earnings. There is a problem here. Our problem is not that people from third world want to get into this country. It is not a problem of civil rights being violated. though, the civil rights card is played first and formost to maintain the status quo of the problem. It's nothing more than a blocking tactic. The problem is that we have rules and proceedures that are written. Add that to the fact that our government agencies are so inefficient, that the easy way is just to open the flood gates and ignore our own laws. illegal is illegal". The problem also exists that this is not immigration as I've stated already. This is invasion. Immigration is a joining of the old and new. Invasion is moving in and taking from others. Answer: *find an efficient and effective way to enforce the laws we already have *emediately deport, upon substantiated proof of non compliance *work harder to transform Mexico to a place that's economically sound and affluent.....1/4 the effort that is spent on the middle east should do the trick * produce a government agency that is capable of documenting and bringing these people above the table. There are always going to be those that want and need to work here, let's get them on the tax rolls and legit. The way i see it, is that the only wrong thing to do is nothing.
I believe its kind of inconsistent as far as the logic goes, couldn't give any particular examples. I think the constitution mostly applies (freedom of speech, etc.) and i know that hospitals have to treat everyone/anyone
