Drug Tests for Welfare

It just doesn't serve your purpose to jump out of the woodwork and start pontificating about the plight of the black man every 10 minutes. It's the same problem that folks like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have. They always play the race card and make it an issue when it isn't, and they're both laughing stocks as a result. I can't speak for America's attitude about welfare and race, but for me there's really no correlation or significance. Black, green, purple, etc. I think the safety net is abused and would like to see it restricted, with opportunity offered up instead of blank checks.

Tassia does the same thing to a lesser degree with the homosexual thing. I'm all for them having equal treatment, equal rights, etc. But she's just so freaking relentless with it that it comes across like that episode of Southpark where Randy Marsh buys a hybrid. You both just seem rather enthusiastic about it for a couple of middle class white kids.

Race is a huge factor in American politics, that is just a fact. If it is never discussed, it will never be solved.

Race is a major factor in the politics of welfare. The links I just provided support that. This thread is about welfare, therefore this thread is also about race.

I know you will throw a hissy-fit when I say this, but the way you insult me simply for being a white person for standing up for the rights of blacks sounds a lot like the more eloquent way of saying:

"you damn nig**r lover"

You probably don't mean it that way, but that's how it comes across.

no, I think the reason people jump your shit for it (or at least the reason I do) is that you come off patronizing as hell. I wasn't thinking or discussing race here, but here comes 950: "Good to know racism is alive and well in America."

This wasn't some commentary on the state of race relations, it was clearly an observation of the attitudes of people here

I agree it wasn't the most clearly stated and well argued post.

Given the evidence I posted above showing how racial attitudes play a major role in perception about welfare, and how welfare policy is created, wouldn't you think it makes sense that people on this forum may hold some of the same beliefs though?

Or is T3D the happy land of total equality where race never once crosses anyone's mind?

would a hair test be better?

Not at all. Although a hair test is much more accurate and detects drugs in your system longer than a piss test (at least for weed, not sure about anything else), they are WAY more expensive.

None of this thread appeared to be about race until someone made it about race. The picture in my mind of a career welfare case is:

with kids like:

and a drug dealing live-in like:
....
...that the welfare department doesn't know about but, keeps a steady flow of drugs and cash coming in. Enough so, as a matter of fact, that those week end drunken beatings are easy enough to overlook and forgive.

That is what I see in my head (and past dealings), when I picture career welfare recipients.

I repeat what I wrote last week: " do not got to the welfare office to pic up chix!!!"

wow the 'off topic' label fits the hell outta this thread

you would think that we are suggesting that we drug test only black welfare recipients...

EDIT: and you guys citing constitutional rights violations and shit, you act like its your right to welfare

In a socialist society they would... DING DING DING!

Wow this thread got out of hand lol.

I brought this subject up in my African American Philosophy class. After I asked the teacher what he thought about it we spent the remainder of class(45 minutes) discussing every way in which White America is trying to hurt Black America some of my notes from class basically stated; "all white people are racist regardless of their current actions because slavery was so terrible it will take unknown amounts of time to heal the black community , furthermore black people are unable to identify themselves causing internal battles which lead them to believe stereotypes which is why they commit crimes."

The point I'm making is I brought up a very current issue and the only response I got from predominately hispanic and african american class was that it's all the white person's fault, let's not take any personal responsibility.(of course I didn't say that in class)

So it causes them to believe stereotypes and commit crimes? AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Damn, I hope that holds up in court.

Yep....excuses and blaming never solved a single cotton picking thing. OOOOoooooooooops....I said "cotton picking".
Funny thing, the rural nature of most of Oregon has a totally difernt thing happening. Most people of color end up actually are making
something out of themselves. Away from the gang mentality, away from the wholesale self pity, away from the antagonists, there is actually
people that have progressed past trasngressions concerning race and social isolation. All it took for them was to accept responsibility
for their success or failures. Maybe that's why I imagine differently when I picture a 'welfare broad' in my mind. Now you get up into the Portland
metro area and things totally change. Gang activity, gheto neighborhoods, private race wars are the norm.

Same thing around me - integration, success, equality. Then you drive into the city and see the self segregated culture in full swing. But we're not allowed to talk about that...

http://web.ccsu.edu/courier/2006/oct/felton_best.htm

This is my professor he has a couple books out in case anyone was interested. He also looks like Biggie Smalls if he had made it to age 50.

They're voluntarily taking government money.

There are benefits to living outside the box. You get to see things other people deny. It's a whole different world out there than people want to believe. Such as: When people get together en'masse, they tend to keep each other sick and support lies that keep them sick. I do know one thing for sure, humankind will not progress any further until we transcend these petty differences and beliefs based on lies. The observation that you and I have made supports this belief.

So you're upset people aren't allowed to talk about race honestly, but you get upset when I try to.... talk about race honestly. Or did I miss something?

I also like how when I posted the VERY strong evidence about racial bias being a factor in welfare policy and perception, it was essentially ignored by everyone who got all upset when I brought up race to begin with.

Look, racism doesn't just come in the form of a white hood and a burning cross. Very often it is still laying right below the surface, and the research shows that pretty clearly.

I'm all for open and honest discussion, but there's been a decent amount of wolf calling and I think folks are just fatigued by it. Even the slightest hint that someone is oppressing little Antuan and you're running for a phone booth! There's a word to describe how it comes off but it escapes me at the moment. And no, it isn't ****** Lover!

Anyway, not sure what you wanted me to respond about the info you posted. I don't doubt that it's true, there was a lot of it...? I liked the font? I personally don't have a racial bias so it really doesn't change my opinion about anything.

EDIT: Of course more white people are on welfare, black folks only make up <15% of the population! Percentage wise I wonder what the number is?

But don't you at least understand that if no one ever brings racial problems up, they will never improve? All I'm trying to do is lay out some facts and get people to think about the world around them and their own beliefs. That includes me of course, which is why I'd like a reasonable and rational debate.

The data I posted was directly tied to what I originally said that made everyone freak out. People are acting like there is no racial component to this issue, I'm just showing that yes, there is. Race and racism, is still a pretty central issue in America, but as you said, people don't like talking about it. I'm trying to talk about it.

And yes, it makes sense that more white people are on welfare due to population numbers, but I was addressing the stereotype that "welfare is for blacks" that many people hold.

As for the numbers:

i missed 950's big ass article in the middle of page 4...

I took his comments to mean that we were all racist and secretly hating on black people in this thread (although that statistically may be true). Post a little more next time than "racism is alive and well in america" I guess?

I was actually for the drug testing at the beginning of this thread and am now against it due to the 4th amendment and xbox arguements

*hugs*



edit: With regard to the 'xbox argument' it applies to everything that costs money.

I mean, it could apply to cloths. Telling people they shouldn't buy those pants because a cheaper pair of pants works just as well, they shouldn't buy those flowers in their yard, the weeds look plenty nice, the list could go on forever. Should the government go into every home that receives help and tell them what they should and shouldn't have/eat/etc? Of course not.

Let me get this strait.....there are 1% more black people on welfare? I thought it was the other way around. personally, I don't bring up racism because it's not an issue in my life. Not that I'm ignoring that it exists, I'm just not around it. The only way for racism to be defeated is to let it begin with ourselves. Fat chance of that happening, people seem to like things just the way they are because they're more than willing to let the other guy solve these types of problems in modern society.
Addressing Jame's concerns: I know case workers with the Oregon state agency that oversee's the TANF funds. They know who is addicted. It's not like they'll have to take stabs in the dark to find out which cases have a drud addiction problem. Those cases become self evident in a short period of time. When getting that next fix is the most important thing in a life, even over the welfare of family and kids, only the delusional think they can hide it. The warning signs are prevailent in all chronic cases: arrests, parole/probation violations, domestic violence, child malnurishment, child appearance, child truancy, and gang activity. The fact is, that without a drug test, their hands are tied in all but the most serious cases.....and the problems compound exponentially with generations becoming caught up in the system of entitlements and courts. The most serious of cases end in foster care/state intervention involving the kids. And most of the time it's too late to do any good. The result? the problem gets worse and more people are born into circle of dependency to drugs and the system. I see it being to the point that the only wrong thing to do is to do nothing.

Have you ever tried to falsify a drug test? They don't make it easy for you these days. Someone basically holds your dick for you when you do it now.


Edit: Also- There are black people in the Northwest?

^^^ What Coleman said. In a previous life I literally performed chain of custody drug screens. Very difficult to falsify.