[ThatHideousStrength]

News N Shit .com / News the Magazine: Hybrid Car Hackers Get 230 mpg

Pretty bad ass. Take that in the ass gas corps!

[Chris]

"At $2.59 a gallon, the Dodge trip to Buffalo NY (from NYC) would cost $90.65. The Prius trip to LA would cost $30.82."

LOL that is awesome.

[gB dAvId x]

Heh that news is 2 years old it looks like :P

[ThatHideousStrength]

Ya I know, it should be known!

[Juballharshaw]

Yes, but Toyota is going to be launching a from the factory plug-in hybrid Prius in the next few years.

[hans5849]

Shit if MS owned that you would get kicked off the road for owning it.

[JustinL]

all sounds good but how hard is it to make lithium ion batteries? what effects to the used batteries have on the environment? how much energy is actually saved when you account for the power plant. Plus, on a trip to LA, how many times would you have to stop and recharge the batteries? The numbers sound good, but if everyone owned an electric car, you'd pay a higher electric bill and they (the power plant) would have to burn more fuel to keep up with supply (unless we go to nuclear power). I think the best solution to the energy problem is in passive energy system such as solar cells and wind turbines. Everything else takes energy to produce (where do you get hydrogen from?)

[Coleman]

Justin is on the right track. The environmental impact that the corroding lithium ion batteries will have on the earth in 10 years will completely offset the environmental gains it has from better gas mileage.

[smirnoff]

Are you ready to have your mind blown?






























[/problems]

[hans5849]

Originally Posted by JustinL

all sounds good but how hard is it to make lithium ion batteries? what effects to the used batteries have on the environment? how much energy is actually saved when you account for the power plant. Plus, on a trip to LA, how many times would you have to stop and recharge the batteries? The numbers sound good, but if everyone owned an electric car, you'd pay a higher electric bill and they (the power plant) would have to burn more fuel to keep up with supply (unless we go to nuclear power). I think the best solution to the energy problem is in passive energy system such as solar cells and wind turbines. Everything else takes energy to produce (where do you get hydrogen from?)

Mass producing an item takes less energy than smaller individual places producing it. Aka 1 big engine (factory) vs small engine (car), the big engine can produce the energy more efficiently. And if you live where I do its probably hydro from the grand coulee.

[WoodButcher]

OK, this article is 2yrs old so where are they today?

[JustinL]

Originally Posted by hans5849

Mass producing an item takes less energy than smaller individual places producing it. Aka 1 big engine (factory) vs small engine (car), the big engine can produce the energy more efficiently. And if you live where I do its probably hydro from the grand coulee.

notice I said "HOW MUCH energy is saved" Powerplants

power plant thermal efficiency
Power station efficiency
(~36 for coal)

ICE thermal efficiency
Engine Science, volumetric, thermal and mechanical efficiency
(~26 for smog engines, 36 for "racing")

[Torx]

dang, they must be up to 400mpg by now!!

[ShabazKillaX]

Originally Posted by Coleman

Justin is on the right track. The environmental impact that the corroding lithium ion batteries will have on the earth in 10 years will completely offset the environmental gains it has from better gas mileage.

It's like that with every environmental breakthrough. Wind turbines kill birds, compact fluorescent bulbs contain mercury. There is always a downside.

[JustinL]

Originally Posted by ShabazKillaX

It's like that with every environmental breakthrough. Wind turbines kill birds, compact fluorescent bulbs contain mercury. There is always a downside.

in my opinion, the best "solution" is through the use of a variety of different energy sources. I think people are looking for one solution, no matter what that solution will be, on a large enough scale we will be back at the same problem we just solved.

[MSP]

I've heard that a factory in Canada that makes the hybrid batteries is so polluted that the land around it is virtually devoid of life. Anybody hear about this before? I'm going to Google it...

EDIT: Here's at least one article that calls "bullshit" on it...

Toyota factory | the Mail on Sunday

[Chainblade]

the thing is, most people don't want a 250mpg car to save the environment, they want it to save money on gas. they could care less about how it affects the environment. so your argument that it might actually cause more environmental problems in the long wrong means nothing. It's all about money.

[MSP]

See, call me a tree hugging hippie if you like, but I actually looked into and seriously considered hybrid and ethanol based cars for environmental reasons knowing that they would likely cost me extra money. At the end of the day there weren't any decent choices within a reasonable price range for me, and their environmental impact was not clear enough. But yeah, I'd spend extra to pollute less.

[Chainblade]

Originally Posted by MSP

See, call me a tree hugging hippie if you like, but I actually looked into and seriously considered hybrid and ethanol based cars for environmental reasons knowing that they would likely cost me extra money. At the end of the day there weren't any decent choices within a reasonable price range for me, and their environmental impact was not clear enough. But yeah, I'd spend extra to pollute less.

I think you are one of the few. It's obvious that people just want what they want, no matter how it affects anything. I'd love to not pollute as much but I, like most, go for convenience. I have an SUV because it's bigger and is a hell of a lot better on my back (being 6 foot 6). Plus it comes in handy all the time to be able to haul things. That and I am comfortable in it when I want to stretch out and take a nap at work . The gas sucks though but that's the only downfall for me personally (besides polluting more). If they would come out with a big SUV that gets good gas mileage and pollutes less, you can be damn sure I'd be all over that thing. But only the small SUV's do that these days.

[JustinL]

Originally Posted by Chainblade

the thing is, most people don't want a 250mpg car to save the environment, they want it to save money on gas. they could care less about how it affects the environment. so your argument that it might actually cause more environmental problems in the long wrong means nothing. It's all about money.

Honda Civic Sedan Hybrid - $22600 - 42mpg combined

Honda Civic Sedan - $21310 - 24mpg combined

Difference - $1290

gas at $3.50 per gallon

you can drive 8800 miles in a regular civic for the amount you would have saved by not getting a hybrid.

I got those number from the manufacturer.... heres some real world testing



2008 Honda Civic Sedan EX LX DX GX models, review, pictures Sedancity.com

32/38 city/highway - assuming 1/2 city driving, you'd have to drive almost 13,000 miles to make up the difference.




you might say "well thats not bad, that is around what I drive in a year...."

SO, lets say you were driving a hybrid the exact same distance and getting 50 mpg, you'd spend 903 dollars in gasoline. so, you would PAY almost 2200 MORE just to "save" money on gas.....






So, that was a little off topic, but they said they'll charge 12,000 bucks to convert a car.

Thats equivalent to 3430 gallons of fuel OR 120,000 miles in the non-hybrid civic. even if they got the cost down to 4,000, that is still 40,000 miles to make up the difference with out driving the other car. the best information I can find is that lithium ion batteries only last 3 years or so, which the average america drives 36,000 miles in 3 years, so about the time you will have made up for the cost of converting to that system (at 1/3 the advertised price), you have to replace the batteries.